HOSTING STANLEY M'HANGO

LIVE NOW; WE HOST FORMER FODEP PRESIDENT, FORMER CHAIRPERSON OF THE TEACHERS SERVICE COMMISSION AND PRESIDENTIAL MANAGER FOR HARRY KALABA TO DISCUSS VARIOUS ISSUES.

Transcript

SPEAKER_15 6:46

Thank you very much and welcome to today's broadcast. Today we are hosting Stanley Mohango. You remember him as FODE president. He held that position for a long time. He's an electoral expert. He's a civil society expert. He he is also fraternized with trade unions, and his last public position was that of chairperson for the teacher's service commission. He was actualizing the teacher's service commission after it was provided for in the constitution of 2016. Remember, we formed various commissions, including Judicial Service Compliance Commission, Judicial Service Commission, Teachers Service Commission, there are all these commissions that were established by the 2016 elections, including the establishment of the Emoluments Commission, a body that's supposed to determine and decide who gets what. So when you see announcements by the president giving chiefs unilateral increment of 5,000 and Wakapasovago 3,000, that's outside the law. The law requires that the emoluments commission looks at such proposals and the emoluments commission must approve. Stani Mohango was running the teacher service commission. But and currently we saw him join the citizen first. And I think uh he is one of the presidential managers for President Hari Kalawa, who tap on his experience and our focus today is on um the position that they've written a letter to international bodies that Zambia may not hold free and fair elections in their letter to the European Union, to SADIC, to the African Union, to the US government, to the British government. An elaborate letter has been written expressing alarm that Zambia is likely to suffer uh uh uh uh what I would call instability because of lack of holding free and fair elections. In this capacity, as an electoral expert, we want Stanley Muango to tell us why they took such a fundamental approach and what are these threats that may make Zambia not hold a democratic, a credible, a transparent, um peaceful, free and fair elections. He breaks down all those five limbs that makes a country have free and fair elections. What are these, why are they threatened? Why what can we do this late in this hour? And um also look at uh the state of the country, and we hope that uh you will join the debate. So, my call to you is we have a wonderful broadcast. Share, share, share. Let's have this discussion, share the broadcast, let everyone know in your circles that we are hosting Stanley Moango, an electoral expert, and the man that has held various, various positions. And we are looking at the threats that are presenting uh uh uh you know the possibility that Zamia may not hold free and fair elections. Um is already in the studio, and I'm just allowing them to set up and he will join us. So I'll use this opportunity to touch on various things. There's been appointments of 40 judges and members of the electoral commission again. A gentleman called um uh sincala has been appointed there, he's a member of the UPND, is an aspiring member for Ruinsha constituency, and he holds a partisan position. He's been appointed by the president to go to ECZ being among ECZ commissioners. Yesterday we held a special broadcast because we are so alarmed by what happened, and what happened was alarming. Information and credible documents leaked out that the police were recruiting up to 4,000 police officers secretly, and the document personally I have demonstrated that they are recruiting 3,000 appointed persons. These young people that have been appointed are supposed to report to Sondela, to Relay, and to to uh Campisa police training colleges today. There are a thousand in each of these schools, and um uh this has raised alarm, especially among young people who think that that process must be equitable. On their position, the Zambia police claim that this is just ordinary staffing. They pick this recruitment because there's been vacancies that have been created by either debts, resignations, and um attrition or desertion or dismissals, whatever could have happened to create those vacancies. But you and I know that such a recruitment to take about maybe 30 people, 20 people. Here it is, up to 4,000 police officers are reporting to the cadets who will be cadets are reporting to the various training centers for the police across the country, and this has raised an uproar in our people who feel totally disenfranchised. These are public resources funded by the state. Remember, Jack Mimbu recently stated that there was uh uh no treasury authority yet to employ 4,000 new police officers, and he says they are still battling with the treasury with Ministry of Finance to ensure that Ministry of Finance can approve in light of the election coming up. Many people have been asking. But the police, you're you have the one of the largest forces. Why would you want new police officers to man the election? Why don't you deploy? And you've put up to a thousand police officers on suspensions, on dismissals, and on hold, up to a thousand police officers. What do you mean you need to employ new people who should run an election? Come on, and if you are employing this late in April, that training lasts six months. By the time they complete their training, it will have been way beyond six months of training. So, why didn't the police use the existing staff? Why didn't they do that? Of course, it is all those issues that have raised alarm about this recruitment that it is unfair, that um is smacking nepotism, tribalism, favoritism, and it is disenfranchising young people. Remember, the head of state has been saying all recruitment will be open, all recruitment will be fair, all recruitments will be transparent, all recruitments will meet the standards set up by the recruitment process by civil service and public service. But the recruitment of the police can best be said to be illegal. So, as I remind you, we have uh Stanley Mohango is already in the studios. Let me just check up if he's ready. Uh, he'll be discussing uh uh the forthcoming elections in Zambia capable of holding democratic, uh credible, transparent, peaceful, free, and fair elections with all the threats we've seen. Uh Stanley Mohango will break down that issue for us. So hold on and share the broadcast quickly. Share, share. Let's see the sharing. Please share. Don't be selfish, share, share so that many people can benefit from it. So see you in a while.

SPEAKER_03 15:11

Political prostitution. Okay. Where now we are seeing the same things that is happening, you say, in in the development, where the civil servant, when the senior civil servant is visiting them, the apparently a person is saying this and this. This is exactly what is doing in the politics. In the first place, a political party is formed under an ideology. A political party is formed under an ideology. If there is a political party that has got no ideology, these are the political parties that they should be the register. It's just like changes. Today I cannot be a Roman Catholic church. Tomorrow I wake up, I'm in RSE, the other day I'm in Zion, the other day I'm in the seventh day. Then what am I standing for? Do I have any principles in the first place? Do I understand why the change I have joined is standing for? The answer is no. This is the political prostitution that we have seen in eastern province. I'm talking about in the Eastern Province because that is where my mandate is. And the political parties that are receiving people that are defecting from this party to this party, they must be very, very careful. There must be very, very careful. For example, let me give you. What they believe in. For example, PF. PF from the way to go from East Founder Michael Sada.

SPEAKER_15 17:20

It is that's Caritas, one of um the Caritas managers is based in Eastern Province. I like his summation that politics he has used very crude language. But this is to define, you know, just a lack of principles and immorality that has uh prevailing in politics, where people can just change political parties. We even have a case, and I hope that uh Mr. Mohango will help me. We even have a case where members of parliament have resigned and joined another political party, publicly announced. Robert Chavinga in Mafinga, he announced and joined the UPND. You have uh uh uh uh Sande Chandakanchi Via even writes on his official page that he has resigned from the PF and that he has joined the UPND. You have uh Wacha MP in uh Kawe, uh Mushanga also writes and is even received by the president that he has joined um the UPND. These are sitting MPs sponsored by other political parties, and the speaker is sitting, their seats are not nullified. I can see that Standy is in the studio. Let's bring him on, my dear brother. Welcome to today's broadcast.

SPEAKER_08 18:42

Thank you very much, uh Ambassador Wamba. It's nice to see you after so many years.

SPEAKER_15 18:49

Yes, indeed, yes, indeed.

SPEAKER_08 18:58

No, you are when duty goes, when duty goes, as you know, who always come up for the second country to defend our democracy.

SPEAKER_15 19:09

Standing, let's get into it. I've already introduced you. Uh let's just get into it. The president, your president, honorable Harikala, recently wrote a very strong letter to the international community, wrote to the EU, he wrote to SADIC, he's written to the African Union, and he's written to two governments, the US and British government. He's saying the forthcoming election is already threatened, we may not hold democratic, credible, transparent, peaceful, free and fair elections. Why did you write such a letter? Is that the is that the paralytic state of our electoral process? I think pick up the debate from there.

SPEAKER_08 19:56

Thank you very much, uh Ambassador and uh Wamba and uh good evening, viewers. In the first place, I would like to say that uh what we are experiencing in this country, in as far as uh our electoral democracy is unprecedented. Having had uh the opportunity to serve as president for the foundation for democratic process for so many years, and having been part and personal to the democratization process and improvement of the electoral process to ensure that Zambia becomes a beacon, a beacon of peace, a beacon of hope for the entire African region in terms of holding credible, free and fair and transparent elections. What we have experienced in the last four years can only be compared to a time when our colonial masters were the ones who are ruling us. As we have said, why has uh President uh Ari Kalama and CF decided to write to the international to the regional and international community concerning the traits that we have seen in terms of the electoral process? Number one, President Kalala did this so as to inform the regional and international community to understand that if they do not come out to actually talk to the Zambian government in terms of uh what has been transferred, we might uh go into an election that will be a shock, which might bring instability to this country. The writing of uh the international community, and I'm happy to inform the nation that uh the five bodies that uh embassies and regional bodies that President Caraban wrote the letter to have since acknowledged the receipt. Of the letter, and we know that uh they will take uh cognizance of the issues that President Kab has raised together with the other uh uh stakeholders as regards the 13th of August uh elections. Number one, we have seen that uh the composition of the electoral of the composition of the electoral commission of Zambia, the body that is mandated to preside over a free, credible, and transparent elections, does not inspire the confidence of the Zambian people. President Kalaba has been on record, just like many other stakeholders in this country, that for the very first time we saw a chairperson of the Electoral Commission of Zambia being appointed who belonged and actively participated in politics, meaning that he was a member of the ruling party. And social media has got photos, they have got videos of uh this uh chairperson, Madam Mangra Zaromis, uh being a very, very active member of uh the uh uh uh uh uh uh UPND. Secondly, we also have another commissioner in the name of uh McDonald Chpenzi. And uh it's sad that uh I and McDonald Chapenzi did work closely at Ford, also who had been aspiring to be a member of parliament under the under the ticket of UPND, together with the recently appointed uh Sinkala. Now, what does this do? What this does is that uh once the players lose confidence in the umpires in an election that brings about that brings about uh uh uh uh uh uh a problem in the in the country. So that is the number one thing. Secondly, we have the conduct of the Electoral Commission of Zambia in terms of uh the roadmap which has been put in place. Firstly, what they did is that they congested the roadmap, they go ahead on their own without consultation with the major stakeholders. So they agreed together uh in terms of what roadmap is going to be used as we go towards uh the 20 uh uh the the 13th August elections. And a case in point, a case in point, as the country may wish to know, is that uh the payment of nomination fees, the payment of nomination fees for presidential candidates should have taken place, should have taken place on the on the 15th of April. Now, upon them realizing the fact that uh the Republican president, President Haka N H Lemba and his party UPND have not fulfilled the required uh uh uh uh the requirements for them to participate in an election, they had to change the timetable so that they could accommodate accommodate them so that they could hold this. And we we have heard it's in public domain, that uh their uh their convention or general conference will be held on the 15th of April, the date which they actually set. The other thing is we are we all aware that uh there is an electro bill process which is on the floor of the house. Now, here is uh what makes uh President Kalaba, a citizen-based party, and many other stakeholders in Zambia is that already, as you had uh stated, uh Ambassador Muamba, a number of PF MPs and independent MPs have crossed the floor. And you don't need anyone to advise you, don't need any rocket science to know to say the law, the constitution is very clear that upon a member of parliament crossing the floor, immediately he or she loses that seat. What cannot happen is holding elections when it is within 90 days of uh the general elections. Honorable uh Sangha from the Patriotic Front did raise a point of order on the floor of the house to actually ask the honorable speaker as to what would happen to this. And honorable speaker, a renowned lawyer, decided to play a blind eye to that. And now you have got an electoral process bill on the floor of the house, which in its current state is going to disadvantage the other players in the electoral process, meaning that already the process of enacting that law is rigged because we have got people who have already crossed the floor. We need the amendment to the constitution. Already people have crossed the floor. So this is why President Kalaba did uh uh decide together with the CF Party to write to our cooperating partners that they should take in interest, be able to deploy the Subject uh observer mission uh on time so that they they they they they they observe the the unfairness that uh the the the UPND government is doing.

SPEAKER_15 28:17

In fact, you know, I was alarmed when I saw the electoral calendar beginning 15th April. First, parliament remains in session. Imagine if you are a presidential candidate, aspiring to be president, yet you are a member of parliament. The law uh forbids you from you know uh uh resigning from your current position and then participating as a presidential candidate. So parliament is city, but electoral calendar was kicking off. And besides the other anomalies you've uh you've stated clearly that was an issue. What are the other issues that have concerned you, maybe with the police, with democratic institutions, maybe with other ECZ? What other issues are threatening the holding of uh the free and fair elections? Does bill seven impact on us holding the free and fair elections? You cited the electoral process bill that is currently in parliament, and there are certain provisions that have raised concerns. Just speak to the other factors that you uh alarmed may threaten Zambia holding free and fair elections.

SPEAKER_08 29:32

Well, the the the other uh issue is uh the application of the Public Order Act. Ambassador Muam uh Mwamba uh and viewers, you may wish to know that uh in the last four years, opposition political parties, let alone any other state actors who could have wanted to hold rallies or protests, have not been allowed to actually uh hold rallies, to actually mobilize their members in the name of state uh threatened state. For example, speaking for the citizen space, the citizen space applied to gave notice to the police 23 times to hold raries, and of these 23 notices that they gave to the Zambia police, the response was that you cannot be allowed to go ahead because of the issues of security. And of these 23, only on three occasions were the citizens face allowed to uh uh hold uh rallies, and part of the rallies that they held that was tied under the the UCA alliance, the other political players have never had an opportunity to hold uh rallies. And how can an election be fair when you do not allow other players? It's like in a football match, Ambassador Mwamba, that uh this team which is in this tournament, they are not allowed or given facilities for them to go and train because they would say the stadium is actually occupied, there is activities, so you cannot uh go and train uh to prepare for the elections. And that is what this government is doing. The freedom of assembly, the freedom of speech or expression under the archaic law, the cyber act law, we have seen how many uh politicians have currently even saving prison sentence because uh of the so-called cyber laws. And we've seen the selective application of the cyber law. When it is one from the ruling party, the UPND, when they are actually cited and it's in black and white, you would find that the police will simply look around. So people are so scared to express their views, people are even so scared to communicate because they know they are under constant watch of the uh security wings. So even as we go towards this election, you hear things like there is no opposition in Zambia, there is uh confusion in the opposition in Zambia. It is there in black and white, where honorable honorable mwetwa, the chief government spokesperson at one of his uh uh um uh uh uh uh conferences, press briefing says yes, he was part and parcel to the confusion in the patriotic front. And you see, it pains me because I know that uh a number of UPND members of parliament and other activists within UPND, we did work closely with them when under the privilege to serve as as president uh of the Foundation for Democratic Press. So if there was going to be any government in this country which should have been more democratic, if there was going to be any government in this country which should have actually presided over a democratic, free, fair, and transparent electron, have been the United Party for National Development. But they have taken us way back to the colonial times where Africans were not allowed to mobilize, where they were not allowed to speak freely, Ambassador. One of their slogans was to left wire Ubuntu. Uh te amayendele Namailandile free to engage and talk about issues that are affecting the Zambian people.

SPEAKER_15 34:37

Oh wonderful. Let's start to the state of the country. What's your assessment?

SPEAKER_08 34:48

Firstly, is that we have a country which is heavily polarized. We have a country which is heavily divided. We have a country that is in pain. We are the country that has been gagged. We have a country where each citizens cannot freely participate, take their leaders, make their leaders to account for their actions. The Zambian people are actually bleeding. The country is bleeding. Let me give uh recent uh happenings. We saw Zambia is endowed with a lot of natural resources, but it still remains one of the poorest countries in Africa. We have foreigners coming to Zambia to come and exploit the natural resources of the Zambian people, and overnight you'd find that these people become millionaires. They acquire so much wealth. It's very much unfortunate that when a Zambia has acquired wealth, then the so-called uh uh uh proceeds of crime engangers. We have a country which, for the very first time in the history of this country, people are being identified by the place where they actually come from. This is unacceptable. I want to call upon the Zambians that our founding fathers founded this country over the one Zambia, one nation. I remember the founding father of Zambia, president uh uh Dr. Kenneth Kawondame, so rest in peace. He used to say, Man south, man north, man west, man east, green, black, orange. We are all made in the image of God. And my prayer and my pray is that let us not allow politics, let us not allow politics to divide us as the people.

SPEAKER_15 37:21

Um peace in the opposition, unity in the opposition has been extremely elusive. Um the state of the country is quite dark, and people are looking, our people are looking, citizens are looking up to the opposition to unite. You are one of the inner personalities in a political party holding a very similar position. Where do you think is the problem? Why can't the opposition come together? The fear is that despite a clear case that President Againde Chima may lose the 2026 elections, the opposition in their fragmentation may give him an edge. You and I have looked at the electoral process in our country very, very solid. Look at the 2001 elections where Lady Patrick Manawassa emerged winner. We had the first past at the time. But the opposition got 70%. The opposition lost that election to Manawassa who got 29% because they scored but their votes were disintegrated to each political party. To FDD, Heritage Party, UPND, you need. And our people are afraid that this may be the scenario in 2026. They know that the UPND may have to be kicked out, but who will they replace them with? So you've forced Zambians to be in pockets of citizen first, of PF, of FDD, of other political parties. What where do you think is a problem?

SPEAKER_08 39:09

Thank you very much. Firstly, I want to state, Ambassador Mwamba, that the biggest opposition that we have against the ruling UPND is not the various political parties that are there. The biggest opposition for the UPND are the Zambian people. Why I say so? Because they are the ones that are actually experiencing and feeling the impact of the bad leadership of the UPNB. Having said that, secondly, is that the disintegration the disintegration, the so-called disintegration of the opposition political parties is as a result of the campaign that the UPNB and have come out in the open where they have actually sought discord within the UPA, within the opposition political parties. But here is here is the comfort that Zambian people should know. I want to tell my fellow countrymen and women that President Harikaram, as a leader of the citizens face, together with his leadership, he has come out in the open to say, in the interest of the Zambian people, in the interest of our mothers, our children, our youths who have no jobs, in their interest, in the interest of our people who have no safe drinker, in the interest of our children who are receiving a free, poor quality education, in the interest of our mothers who are dying because of lack of uh drugs in the hospital. He is ready to work together with other opposition political parties so that they can respond to the demands of the people. And that is why President Kalawa, I think about three almost a month ago, he came out and said, Gentlemen, let us not cheat ourselves. Let us come together. Let us come together, let us hold hands, let's spawn to the demands of the people and for. And I want to uh just assure you, Ambassador uh Mwamba and uh ferozambians, especially those uh who are in the diaspora, that uh President Hari Kalaba has taken the lead, and it is there in the public domain where you have seen President Kalaba talking to his uh dear young brother, President Kebi Mah Kebi uh Kebi Zuru, trying to see how they can forge this unity because there's that response. You have seen President uh uh Hari Kalaba uh reaching out uh uh to his big brother, uh President uh KBF. You have seen President Hari Kalaba reaching out to President uh uh Munduvide, even when President Mundubire at that time was arrested, you saw that he was one of the presidents who was there. You have seen him reaching out to President Lubinda. So, President Kalaba has stated and has even told us in the uh citizens' face that we need to go into this election united as in response to the demands of the Zambian people. And that is why citizens face as a political party, uh even its name, it talks about citizens' face. It is not about Hari Karaba, it is not about Brian Mundiride, it is not about Kebi Mazulu, Magebi Zuru, it is not about Lubinda, it is not about Wakampuidi, it is about saving the soul of this country. Come 13th August 2026, Zambians have got to be reverented. And he has been very clear that this shall only be done, this shall only be done through unity. And I'm happy to report as a person who has been privileged to have to be the presidential campaign manager and be also in the presidential task force to inform the Zambian people that uh we are talking, President Kalaba is talking to. Everybody. It's like Ichichibata Filiangle Chibona Cheshumbucafe. But uh what you might not see is that there is a lot of public underneath underneath there.

SPEAKER_15 44:12

Yeah, yeah. Let's come to the hot issues, the recruitment of judges, the recruitment of police officers, the new cadets that are reporting up to 4,000 of them in a process that is at best secret. And I think this has riled Zambians. What is your view of all these issues that uh President Akainde Ichilema is engaged in?

SPEAKER_08 44:46

You see, Muchiwe, my mother was Bemba, my father Chumbuka, the mother to my mother, to my father was Denji, and I grew up on the copper belt. Muchemba Vatila Muchiwem. And the Bible talks about that whatever is done in secrets shall be brought out in the open. And this is exactly what has actually happened. And for me, Ambassador Muamba, fellow country women and women, I want to say God loves this country. The exposition of what is happening in the police service and recruitment of uh recruitment of uh of police. Actually, this was revealed by the UPND cards themselves. We have seen it on social media. I've seen my young brother uh there who has been lamenting to say, but why have you done this? So the thing here is to say that uh we need a United States. The Service Commissions Act of uh number 10 of 2016, it clearly states, Ambassador, that uh recruitment or deployment or opportunities in the civil service should be on merit. No one should be discriminated against, it should be transparent, it should be competitive. I had a privilege to save the Zambian people as a chairperson of the teaching service commission, and I was part and parcel to the drafting of uh regulations and guidelines when we are devolving some of the functions of the service commission, from the service commissions to the district human resource management committees, firstly for the police. There was an internal memo as they want to ask to believe that there was an internal memo. Now, when you are looking at the internal memo, these are new recruits, and then you put an internal memo, new recruits who do not work for the Zambia police service. How can that be can that be possible? An internal memo can only be put for when they are positioned for promotion. They have been vacant positioned as a result of separation by way of uh retirement, by way of death, by way of dismissal. Then the the the the the the the the the the vacancies are created and these vacancies which are created as people are moving up are the vacancies of constables. And then the entire police service under the watch of the service commission, chairperson and uh and this committee want us to believe that there was an internal memo which was put, which was circulated, and people started applying to be to join the police service as constables. We also they also want us to believe that no, there was uh a database. There was a database. If really what they are saying is genuine, what they should have then done was actually to inform the public that uh the replacements that are going to take place, because there are two types of recruitment, there is what we call net recruitment. This net recruitment, this is a recruitment that takes place where the cabinet creates more positions and there is uh there is treasury authority to fill those positions with those new vacancies which have been created. Then there is what we refer to as replacements. These replacements, these are the vacancies which are created. They already exist, they have been funded. So what they should have done was to say, since we had received applications in the last police service recruitment, as the Zambia Police Service Commission, we are going to look at those that are actually applied, and this is what we are going to do, and that is what the values of human resource management in the service commissions entails, transparency. So I want to call upon, I want to call upon the Zambia Police Service Commission that they should come out in the open and tell the Zambian people the truth. If anything, the most honorable thing that should happen to this recruitment, because it is tempted, as we have heard, as we have seen, is for the service commission, the Zambia Police Service Commission, they have got powers to nullify the recruitment as done by the body which has delegated authority to. So this, in our view, as uh as uh citizens first, is but nothing but underhand methods. We also want to call upon the the public uh protector to take keen interest about what this is actually happening because it is that type of conduct, excuse me, it is that type of conduct by those that have been discharged with this responsibility that actually makes the country get divided. Because now people will be looking, as they are looking at the names, instead of checking, okay, is this one qualified? Is this one qualified by way of academic qualification, by way of age, and whatever is that is good, people now will begin to start looking at this name, where does it come from? This name, where does it come from? Even when the recruitment could have been genuine, but because of the manner in which you have undertaken the recruitment, suspicion starts creeping in, especially in an age where there is no job creation in the under this government. As citizenship, as citizens faced, part of our 100-day plan is to ensure that when it comes to jobs in government, in parastators, this shall be done on merit and transparently. It is not about who are you connected to, it is not about which political party you belong to, it is not about which region you come, you you come from. Our forefathers laid a very strong foundation where, for example, I told people to say, my name is Tandy Mohambo, my grandmother on my mother's side, on my father's side was uh was Marembeka from the Lange Land. My mother is Lunda from Wansabombu. And I ask myself, who am I? Am I Lenji? Am I Tumbuka? Am I Lunda? At the end of the day, I find that I am a Zambian. So the only tribe that we have in this country is Zambia.

SPEAKER_15 53:37

Yes, indeed. Yes, indeed. Dear viewers, we are hosting Stanley Muhango, uh, is an electoral expert. He last served as a teacher service commission chairperson, is currently one of the presidential managers for Citizen First President Hari Kalawa. We are discussing the possibility of Zambia holding democratic, credible, transparent, peaceful, free and fair elections if possible. He has highlighted all these insecurities that have arisen, threatening the democratic process of our country. Uh, he's also touched on other parts. I'm just taking a small commercial break and I will invite you to call and ask uh Mr. Mohango any question that you may have in relation to the topic of the day.

SPEAKER_12 54:31

As um we go towards elections. It's very important for people to maintain their confidence in the judiciary. The judiciary means well. It is not made up of politicians. We are all political. And uh therefore we mean very well we need to dispense justice. And we hope that uh the disputes that will arise in the run-up to elections will be resolved quickly, and those that will arise after elections will equally be resolved as quickly as possible, and in the best manner.

SPEAKER_20 55:58

As we all know, elections bring increased political tension, large public gatherings, high expectations from citizens, and the new security challenges. This therefore calls for the Zambia police to adequately prepare in order to effectively maintain law and order and police the general elections. Traditional methods alone are no longer sufficient. Transformation requires us to shift from reactive policing to predictive, intelligence-led and community-oriented policing. It challenges us to adapt to modern realities.

SPEAKER_16 56:49

This conference will therefore critically analyze the prevailing political and security environment and formulate practical measures to ensure that the forthcoming elections are conducted in a peaceful and conducive atmosphere.

SPEAKER_15 57:14

The assurances from President Hakainde Ichilema, from his key officials like Jack Mwimbo and the Inspector General of Police, and from Isaiah Chairperson is that Zambia will have free and fair elections, but the actions are totally different. If you look at the way they are deplatforming uh political leaders, you know, from the PF, from NCP, their threats even against FDD and others. No one is immune from these attacks. The way uh uh NRC and voter registration were issued, you can see that this was not done in a transparent and credible way. It somehow advantaged areas where the UPND are strong. There are all these threats. Despite all these issues, how ready, Mr. Mwango, are you to participate in this election? How ready is the citizen first?

SPEAKER_08 58:12

Thank you very much. The citizens face is actually ready for this election, despite the challenges that you have alluded to uh Ambassador Wamba. Firstly, I want just to put it on record that uh it took 11 months, 11 solid months, for the citizens face to actually be recognized and certified as a political party. This is the environment under which we are operating. Despite all these maneuvers and ratos, I want to say that uh citizens face as a political party, they have in place all the documentation or the requirements ourselves at seasons faced at present calaba. We are actually ready to go and pay the presidential nomination fees on the 15th of April. But first to government, the party president. Now you see Z Namo, thinking and believing they are part of UPNG, they quickly deferred the schedule because they thought that they would catch the other opponents, like the PF, uh President Bakebizulu, the other time they were saying that it's a no-party, it has a no-party name, but there's a president, President uh uh Mundwile under FDD. They might also not file because they're having challenges right now to actually uh have their the the the their resolutions and have new offs bearers for the city for the FDD. So NCP, they went, they had a convention. What did we see? We saw that uh President Peter Chanda, just because just because uh President Peter Chanda had a discussion with President Make Bizul before we knew it through the the underhand methods of the UPND government, they had instigated the the firing of President Peter Chanda and a fresh so-called fresh uh uh uh convention was held. So there are all these things and the more reason, the more reason President Harikal has said, gentlemen, let's put our hands together because in God's own wisdom, even when the enemy is planning this and that, at the end of the day, God has showed us the way. We have uh we have uh since advertised for those that want to contend at local government level, at parliamentary level, and we have received overwhelming response throughout the country, the materials are ready, the the structures, the campaign structures have been put in place. But most importantly, for President Kalawa and citizens' face, this election we need to go in as a united force. And that is why, even as we are doing these preparations and citizens' face, we are still engaging and President Kalaba is engaging, and I'm very positive, fellow Zambians, that uh come the presidential nomination day, what will happen is going to shock this country because Zambia loves God sorry loves this country.

SPEAKER_15 1:02:17

Thank you very much, dear viewers. I'm hosting Stanley Muango Muango, um an electoral expert, and you know, he's is a civil society guru. He was for the president, and then he has participated in the electoral process. We are discussing how Zambia is ready to hold free and fair elections, if possible, with all these threats coming from the police, from ECZ, from registral societies, and from recent legal and constitutional amendments that have taken place. Usually, when I have a live program, I want to release my guests very early because you know they stay far and we are using a studio somewhere sometimes for especially opposition leaders, it's good that they go early. So let's quickly take your calls if you have a question to ask um uh Mr. Stanley Mohango. The lines are open. Uh let's get your views quickly so that then we can um allow you then to call later and then we can close the program. The lines are open, and I want you to ask Honorable Stanley Mohango. Um, we saw the chaos under the UPND. There's been violence and frictions under the general conference, intra-party conference that they are holding. I can see we have a caller already for Mr. Stanley Mohango. Um, caller just hold on a bit. Let me just uh do this. Cola, good day, and please um uh tell us your name and where you're calling us from.

unknown 1:04:03

Thank you.

SPEAKER_15 1:04:04

Oh, just hold on, just hold on. I didn't realize I put him in charge. Yeah, hello caller. Please tell us your name and where you're calling us from. And do you have a question for Mr. Stanley Mohango?

SPEAKER_04 1:04:16

Yes, sir. I actually have a question and a contribution quickly.

SPEAKER_15 1:04:22

Thank you.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:22

My name is Uncle J.

SPEAKER_15 1:04:24

Thank you, Uncle J make your contributions.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:27

Um, a very um good submission that um to the comrades has actually made indeed that that is the state of our country. We do not have uh confidence in this that they will actually believe an election because we know that an election is a process, is a process. It has to start, it starts from way back on the actual level of voting. But what we are seeing in our country right now, there is not likely that we are going to have a free and fair election in a place where the opposition has never been given an opportunity to interact you know with uh the citizens. Um we see that the police has made it very difficult for the opposition in Zambia to do um their campaigns. Okay, and today we are talking about this which is a composition of the UPAD itself.

unknown 1:05:28

That is not easy.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:30

For me, that is um a UPAD organ, and I hope that the opposition will look into this and will not agree to go into a direction looking at these the same individuals that are saving at the home of this in the question is to um to the compliment looking at the country that has involved our country democratically. What is it that you think must be done to undo the damage that has been done? Is uh I like when he says President Kalawa and himself and others are ready to work with anybody that is in unity.

unknown 1:06:17

To what extent would you love that particular unity? Would President Kalava uh is President Kalava willing to stand, for example, as a running mate or a president, whichever way, is he willing to give up that position for another person? Yeah, those are my few questions.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:37

Thank you.

SPEAKER_15 1:06:38

Thank you very much. Two questions for Mr. Uh Mohango. Hello, Cola. Please tell us your name and where you are calling us from and give us your contributions.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:48

Daniel from Kepta.

SPEAKER_15 1:06:50

Daniel, make your submissions.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:54

Uh, good evening, honorable and good evening. Uh Mr. Mohango.

SPEAKER_15 1:07:01

Good evening.

SPEAKER_06 1:07:02

First question to Mr. Mohango is uh looking at the current situation with the issues and the UPND and even be happy to have experience in civil society. Why don't the opposition maybe find the plan B in doing things because we've seen that the UPNT by employing those police officers it shows that elections will be something that the wants to stop people because as we have seen, there's no state from the opposition that maybe a country should employ all those police officers because the opposition has been denied any uh ordinary varies, parties have been denied to be registered and everything yet. We haven't uh seen any maybe force from the opposition, but him having experience of uh civil organization, what would he tell the people what are other ways that we can fight things such as employing uh 4,000 before it goes through? If we need to take it to the streets, uh do a peaceful demonstration, which I don't see happening, has it got any uh other ideas that we can do? Because I see Akainde going through with anything that he comes up with, with no fight put across. When I say no fight, I don't mean bloodshed or anything, but just peaceful demonstrations. Thank you very much.

SPEAKER_15 1:08:54

Yeah, Mr. Mango, maybe you can take those two calls, but also add my question. Because you are former chairperson of the teacher service commission. The country expressed worry when they saw teachers on Teachers Day um endorsing the president. Some even had banners endorsing president. Are public service workers allowed to engage in partisan politics in that manner?

SPEAKER_08 1:09:23

Then you can take the other two questions, but uh Ambassador uh public service workers allowed to engage in partisan politics. The answer is a big no. And I want to respond to this matter in this way when you saw what we uh watched on social media publicly teachers uh endorsing President Hari, sorry, President uh uh Hagainde Hilema, in the first place, it has never happened in the history of this country. I want to say that because I was a single servant for 30 years, for more than 30 years, and I was a trade unionist, a teacher trade unionist for over 20 years, and at no time, even as we would engage political parties, both the ruling and the opposition, where at one point we had the civil servants actually coming out publicly in front of the president, and the president does not see anything wrong, but here lies the problem what you saw happening there, where those civil servants were endorsing the said president, is purely out of fear. The trade unions in this country have been intimidated, they have been intimidated. That is why you do not hear any voice of any trade union. The only voice that you hear from the trade union movement is we endorse, we endorse, we endorse, we conquer, we agree, and that is not for their own liking, it is for their own survival because the moment that they are to stand for the people that they represent, the next thing is that their subscription is going to dwindle. Membership would be moved through the female system. But I want to appeal to my colleagues, of which most of them have worked with your call to work as a representative of workers, it is not about self-preservation, it is about speaking on behalf of the suffering masses who are the poor workers. So that is condemned, and I want to call upon the teaching service commission. Most importantly, the teaching council of Zambia. Both public and private teachers, private teacher sector. And what those teachers did is unethical, and we want to see the teachers in the council of Zambia, my brother register, who my left with to actually put up that is to come out in the open and condemn what has actually happened. Secondly, what is it that as citizens face the civil society organization will do to undo the damage that has been done by the UPNB as we go towards elections. Firstly, I just want to assure them I have been around this country, I live in the villages, in the rural areas of this country, and everyone is saying it's time for UPND to live because they have failed to deliver on what they actually promised. So, in as much as they have guarded the opposition leaders and political parties from freely cannabis for support from their people, the good thing is that the opposition that the UPND has is not Hari Karaba, is not Mundumire, is not Maketi Zuru, but it is the Zambian people themselves. And that is why Hari Karaba, being a person who listens, who responds to the challenges and cries of the people, has actually put himself in front and made sure that before these elections, he made sure that everything was in place for his political party. He has put himself up to actually be voted and working together with other political parties. Is President Harikal ready to work with the other political leaders in the opposition? The answer is a big yes. He has said it publicly that he is ready to serve in any position as a leader. But what should also be understood is that it is not about just kicking out President Agaim de Hejrema and his failed project, but equally it is about what are the ideas, what are the issues that are bringing us together. And I want to report that so far from the discussions and engagements that are being undertaken, there is a lot that has many leaders have gotten attracted to President Ari Kalama to actually provide leadership. Brother Daniel from uh Cape Town. What plan B do we have because of the current state of affairs where as opposition political parties we are not allowed to campaign freely, we are not allowed to uh to express our opinions freely because everyone is scared of cyber of the cyber cyber act. I want to assure you that uh in President Harikarawa and his team and many other opposition political parties are working, working to ensure that uh they put in place measures, lawful measures to swarm the stealing of uh votes. We want to assure you that uh very soon the citizens face party under the leadership of launching, will be launching a project of uh defend your votes. Then, in terms of what are we going to do to these parties and Electrical Commission of Zambia uh officials, as citizens faced, we are on record and we have demanded that uh the three commissioners, Chairperson Wangra Zaromis, my young brother Commissioner Magdalene, and recently appointed commissioner. In the interest of democratic, free and fair elections, peace in the nation, they should willingly step down because the Zambian people have no confidence in you. My brother Spence, I know we worked together for a long time. My mother, honorable uh the chairperson, honorable uh, I knew her the time when she was in unique as a national women's chairperson, I was a youth leader, I knew her. These are not the values, principles under which those of us, even as youths, when we belonged to unit, it was about protecting the integrity, it was about uniting the nation. So if they are not going to step down, if uh the electoral process bill is not going to be withdrawn, us as citizens, first working together with other peace-loving Zambians, we shall notify the police on having countrywide peaceful demonstrations as a way of protesting our dissatisfaction because we want to protect our electoral electoral democracy.

SPEAKER_15 1:18:31

Um Mr. Mwango, you raise a fundamental issue that I probably should have touched on. The to guard the vote, the vote protection uh mechanism that should be implemented. You have over 12,200 polling stations. The constituents constituencies we know who rise from 156 uh to uh to 226 plus nominated. Um I can see maybe let's take the last two callers and then I get back to you. Let's just take the last call two callers that have uh questions for you. Um please uh to tell us your name and where you're calling us from. We are hosting Mr. Stanley Mohango, is um former Ford President, former teacher service commissioner chairperson, and is currently uh a presidential manager under citizen first, Honorable Harry Karaba. Make your contribution.

SPEAKER_14 1:19:47

Uh Ambassador, I never because uh understanding Mabamba politics uh ambassador.

SPEAKER_15 1:21:42

Um Mr. Munkonge has asked a very fundamental question with your knowledge about the electoral process and with the threats that are there that the vote for by Zambians might be stolen. Is it possible that you form not just a vote protection unit under your party, but you collaborate with other political parties so that you pull your resources and personnel? When I'm saying last callers now, people are calling just hold on, Mr. Muango. Hello, caller, please tell us your name and where you're calling us from and uh make your contribution. Hello, yes, we can hear you. Tell us your name and where you are calling us from and make your contribution.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:34

Good evening, my man and uh comrade uh my name is Charles Kakula.

SPEAKER_15 1:22:43

Charles Kakula, our dear brother Charles. How are you? I'm fine and Londenipo.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:56

Just to start with um, I just want to recommend uh comments, but uh with the past experience that you have both in the civil service and in politics. Uh we have seen this in Tribalka in the China point judges is cards, and we have seen uh this secret recruitment which was in uh Zambia Police Service. Uh in politics. Mr. Mumango, I want to make sideways. Shabanga characters, name could experience any because I'm a sign to point Amasign to the Munam study cruelty, Makapokola. And the police stations, much penazia, um could not make the number for my push country, push them. Are we safe? Because I'm changing, but we want a short. So is it possible when it comes to position? So that changed technology for so Makanamba in a Zambia was familiar. So Amantu on behalf of the Zambian people, especially the youths, to the Bangashian, please position, Amantuan, and Kakwa.

SPEAKER_15 1:26:09

Thank you, thank you, Charles Kaku Kakula from um uh from Europe. Avocola, please tell us your name and where you are calling us from. And uh we are hosting Mr. Stanley Mohango, an electoral expert, former teacher service commission chairperson and currently presidential manager uh under Honorable Harry Kalaba.

SPEAKER_10 1:26:31

Good evening. Um my name is Bella. I'd like to ask a question in regards to political fairness. Um, Honorable Um Mohanko, uh, is it realistic to think that number one, the Zambian government has the capacity, the manpower, and the resources to handle the delimitation that has been done literally at one point, so already the processes and the protocols that it takes for such a task for a country like Zambian. I I feel that we do not have the economic resources to pay civil servants already. We are seeing the highest rate of suicide, the highest rate of debt defaulting amongst the civil servants. We have cases of people working and not getting paid at once at the highest institution. And then, boom, there you go, 4,000 more employees. How are these going to be paid on an already destroyed economy? Now, forget the fact that they are police. In a time where we have seen the most violent unpolice who don't actually know what they're doing, because the first thing that UPND as a government did was fire a good number of Zambia National Service officers and police officers just based on their affiliation. So I'm asking you, as an expert in your field, do we really, after the recent appointment of judges who are clearly biased, why has the ICCJ not been engaged? Why have we not seen international cases opened on the UNHCR reports? And we're delving deeper into the waters. I'm almost scared of the fact that we're sitting having this conversation that we shouldn't be having. Are we really? I don't know. I'm stuck for words.

SPEAKER_15 1:29:19

Thank you. Thank you, Bella.

SPEAKER_10 1:29:21

In the expert capacity, can you foresee a situation where we have a free election in August? That is my question to you, sir.

SPEAKER_15 1:29:31

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Bela. Wonderful question. Let me take the last call, then uh we allow Mr. Mwango to answer the queries, and then we we call, you know, we we ask him to say his last remarks. Let's just take the last uh uh caller and then we we allow Mr. Mwango to respond. Mr. Mwango, just give me a minute. There's a persistent caller who's calling. Let's just take his call. I think he has something to say. We have various questions that have come in and uh some are text, but I think let's concentrate on the voice. His line keeps on cutting, but he's been trying very hard to call. Let's just see if we can uh take this call. Hello, colour. Please tell us your name and where you are calling us from and make your contribution.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:39

Thank you, Ambassador Mwamba, and thank you, Bamwango. Uh I'll just urge all Zambians that are listening today. Uh Bamwango, even others. Now they still recruit bakapo kola. Our job is also easy. Let us also start recruiting more voters. And us, our job should even be much easy because we voted to kayakumu yufi. Banku promise, we farma, bali kwebatela fetalize a bamutengue shit. Ushinango bakubela. Bali mabungu sama zambians, bali tuba tubungo kamapa fifte kuwacha. Usha wungana numboripa fifte kucha. So Amabien, inchite ya weakusa recruit makapokona. But it's upon us all Zambians that love Zambia to recruit more voters. And as we are recruiting them, we just tell them what they were promised and what if that has been fulfilled. Thank you, Sana Ambassada Mamba. God bless Zambia. That's what I'm calling.

SPEAKER_15 1:31:43

Thank you, thank you. Uh last caller. I'd said last caller, but this will be our final, final caller. Hello, caller. Please tell us your name and where you're calling us from and uh make your contribution quickly.

unknown 1:31:54

Yeah, um thank you so much.

SPEAKER_07 1:31:57

From Livingstone.

SPEAKER_15 1:31:58

Moa from Livingstone, we are hosting Mr. Stanley Mohango. Please ask your question or make your contribution.

SPEAKER_07 1:32:06

Yeah, thank you so much, and uh really appreciate from Mr. Mohangu and um the insights that he has given regarding the expertise in uh managing elections. I think he um for me for me for me Mr. Mohangu is a serious stakeholder, especially the elections that are coming. Stakeholder, I mean uh there's something that they have that this they have something that they are bringing to the table. They understand the the strategies of how elections can be best managed in the best of protection against um and um electronical practices. Now, um one thing that I want to mention to the Zambians is that um I don't I don't know how many signs that we want to see from you from UPD for us to agree that we are yet to face a tough election in August 2026. I can dress you back to um Dr. Eccusan Gorum was treated even before his demise. That we are part of the confusion in the PF. We came to B7. The president was very clear when he came to some of the province that the would have lost elections if we did if it if B7 didn't go through. Okay, that was the confusion that came from the head of state.

SPEAKER_15 1:35:39

Thank you, Mambo. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

SPEAKER_07 1:35:42

Um electro electro electoral process code in there change electrical code. No, the question is what are we doing about it? You you my single Zambian, you and me, because when the ones who are feeling this pain, what are we doing about it? Are we going to wait to say so? This is a moment where we need opposition unity, so that opposition political party comes with the expertise and we make one common uh go. It doesn't matter who is the president there. Okay, coming to the Makeb is always the president for the largest political parties under the patronic plant, and the understandably the patronic front has got structures in all the district and the country, as demonstrated in the previous convention we held when 111 districts participated. We've got structures everywhere. Among opposition political parties when the when it's a Pangate team instead of quick.

SPEAKER_15 1:37:22

Thank you, thank you. Uh Stanley, please just indulge me. Hello, caller. Please tell us your your your name and where you are calling us from, and uh, we need to allow Mr. Muhango to go, but quickly ask. We this program is about you. Quickly ask.

SPEAKER_09 1:37:39

Hello, good evening to you. Nina Nameless. I have got no name. Yeah. Sorry, uh Muhango. There aren't many questions to ask. Yeah, I'm just pleased for the pronouncement, for the pronouncement you have made to the public saying that uh the president Hari Kalama is fought in ahead in conducting other parties so that they could link up together. You know, we know very well that this has uh been a cry out of everybody who are affected, including myself here. Yeah, the reason to this is because even though we are out of the country, we've been leaving out just to try and help our families who have been suffering so much, and we talk for them. And uh, if you really mean what you have said, this is going to help a lot of Zambians because I know that a lot of Zambians today are suffering so much, so much that some of them they don't even know what to eat the next day, and it's so sad when you see a person who maybe just a few years ago at three meals, and today they are having a meal. Some people not even a meal, it's also sad. So, really, if you have meant what you have pronounced, this is going to be a great thing to do, and you are a great leader because you are not uh scared of anything, you have come publicly and we are telling everyone what's happening because there are not so many people who do this. Yes, we know very well what's happening. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_15 1:39:43

Thank you, thank you. Thank you, Honorable Stanley Mwango. Let me bring you in. Now the lines is ringing everywhere. No, not allow this. Stanley lives very far. He has to go. Thank you very much, dear callers. I might allow you to go after Stanley has gone because this is social media. I can allow you, but let me allow Honorable Stanley Mwango to answer the questions and offer his last remarks.

SPEAKER_08 1:40:10

Thank you very much. Um, I want to say and assure the Zambian people, those within Zambia and the diaspora, that President Harikalaba has given himself to actually lead his country together with many well-being Zambians. And also just to assure you that we are dealing with the president that is principled, the president that is present, the president that is prepared. And with what you have actually alluded to, President Kalaba and his team is very much experienced. That is why we as citizens face, we say Zambians did make a very big experiment in 2021 and see where we are. So it is about experience versus experiment. Once beaten, twice shy. In terms of water protection, I can assure you that as citizens face, we are working closely with various organizations and institutions to make sure that we protect your rights, we protect your core. I want to inform the nation that already as citizens face, we have since written to several non-governmental organizations, the church mother bodies, the workers' organizations, explaining to them the same challenges that you are talking about in terms of how, if we do not arise to the occasion, how the vote is going to be stolen. President Kalava believes that together we are strong, together we shall protect uh this uh this vote. Indeed, yes, is Zambia has it got the capacity under Bill 7, which went again in a very undemocratic way, and this is a warning and a call out to the Zambian people that whoever whoever voted for Bill 7 voted against the wishes of the people, was in support of the sufferings of the people, and should not be able to see the inside, the inside of parliament or in the inside of the corridors of power because they betrayed. My question I want to ask, just like uh my sister did ask, does Zambia have got the economic capacity to have 74 constituencies? The answer is a big no. What is it that the 156 members of parliament or 61 members of parliament, what is it that they have failed to do? Which only when you increase by 70 of those seats they will be able to do this, as others have alluded to, it was part of. And in terms of how we are going to protect the borders, you have said, we are working and working silently. You cannot actually tell your enemy on how you are going to make sure that those any those missiles do not land uh in his place. I just want to assure the Zambians that all these issues that you are you have raised are being taken care of. Lastly, as you have said, uh Ambassador Muhammad, I just want to thank you first for the role that you are playing in trying to give the Zambian people a voice, as you know that uh even the media is threatened every time that they want to give uh chance to other voices. You in a very difficult situation where they have made you to leave your family, living away from your family, but you have never let this country down. I want you to believe that you and I, uh uh uh Ambassador Gwanza, you know the trenches that we have walked in. We know what we have done to make sure that uh this country always comes out of an election in a very peaceful way. And I know you are playing your role, and I just want to say for President Hari Kalaba is hearing all the issues that you have actually raised and is ready to save and is ready to provide leadership to ensure that Zambian people are delivered from this problem. His hands, his team, they are open to receive whoever has heard the cry of the Zambian people. Finally, I want to say please, for the last time, do not do not compromise experiments over experience. President Kaaba is an experienced leader, former class, a diplomat, and indeed a god-fearing person who offered himself well back to the Zambian people to provide leadership. And together with you, together with us, together with my together with my KBM, together with my president saying, brothers and sisters, brothers and sisters, let us join hands and liberate the Zambian people from the suffering they have experienced in the last four years. I thank you.

SPEAKER_15 1:46:46

Thank you very much, Mr. Mwango. I love the proposal by uh two or more callers who've proposed that because of uh your vast experience, especially with the electoral process, that you should consider setting up an inter-party vote, you know, vote protection unit of some kind where you collaborate with other political parties to protect the vote. I think you and your party must consider that so that you make available the huge resource that you are to you know to help the opposition in that light. So God bless you. Thank you for coming and travel safely home. Dear viewers, we're hosting Mr. Stanley Mohango, is a presidential manager at Citizen Fest, is former FODEP president, his former teacher service commission chairperson, and we're discussing the threats uh against Zambia's holding of free and fair elections. Until we have another guest, thank you very much to the callers. Now you have gotten busy when we are ending the program. Thank you very much for those innumerable calls now that you are making. But we have to allow the team and Mr. Mohango there at the studio somewhere to travel safely. God bless you. We'll see you tomorrow.

SPEAKER_03 1:48:05

Political prostitution. Okay. Where now we are seeing that is happening. You say in uh in the development, where the civil servant, when the civil servant is visiting them, the parental is saying this and this. This is exactly what is going on.

SPEAKER_15 1:48:26

Someone was asking me, who is this man you keep on playing about? Is Mr. John Tadziko Zulu from his partner director of characters? Uh his remarks are very apt with what's happening in the electoral process. It's very remarks that is happening with people defecting, even abusing the constitution, defiling the constitution without vacating their seats. So what he's talking about is very important, and that's why I play him. So it's John Mutaziko Zulu, is Caritas. You know, Caritas is uh an angel owned by the Catholic Church, is a director in Chapata, John Mutazico Zulu. Thank you, John, for those candid remarks.

SPEAKER_03 1:49:17

Political prostitution. Okay. Well now we are seeing there's something that is happening. Well, the civil servant, what is civil servant is the most problem, the parent person, this and this. This is exactly what is going on in the politics. In the first place, a political party is funded under an ideology. A political party is formed under an ideology. If there is a political party that has got no ideology, the political party is not ideology.

SPEAKER_19 1:51:38

When you look at the UPND, for example, from the time of Mazoka, the way we have understood the MMD, I mean uh UPND, is is we want change, we want change, we want change, we want change, hey, we want to change all in the body, but you the sound Why on the big boy, ging at the wabou belly both, ging that bomb the while you want the bottom The while you want the bull, Tina Bombay Ouilla Belé, what's the baby Ouya baby Ouilla baby Why to lay on a boy guess at the bang up with the boyboy kiesa to bang it up with me on one child guess at the pool in the chip at all you fetch you won't want to guess at the cool must that you do not even say what you battle at the wavelength I banned to a bit of four years away to the bottom of the stadium No ballet on my full way We took me for Télé Bakou Bellybo, Tina Wa Bombay Papou Bellybo, Tina Wabai, the wallet, a bomb, tiny bébé boule bébé coule faible bombé la noche à bakrice à coup non ko te miramano te la baya Nago tu pele enga la matoule poca ta toi boute Bigothebaya coupelaya A babina te mou na bokole boba fuma baile na babé Aye Kouta pizza Bala botou babou mae Aïe Kouta bay Bala batibacavouya Bay a chikenine na mabanou y na panakas so la bona le bot mo la beija to la bot bistarina y fouet Boli to la babonale no mapuela y mwe fle to me fou tire botin' that uh walib on the footing that we're no one got the new baby.